Electric vehicles and alternate fuel sources

Lang wrote:

Here is a go. What about electro magnets in light pistons that only go on for a split second at top dead centre.

Wow, electric  magnetic and hybrid to provide the power. All bases coveredv

My head is still spinning think about them cables feeding the magnets in the pistons bouncing up and down.

I think you need to think of electric cars in terms of power tools, 10 years ago I carried a 7 kva generator on the Ute and a heap of extension leads and only used battery powered tools in desperation because they were next to useless, now ten years down the track the only power tool I carry is a little welder in the next ten years we will have another giant leap from Lithium to the next generation of battery's and there is a couple in the pipe line, then it will be end of story, electricity is free I make 60amps @ 240 volts in the back yard every day. People accept electric motor in their fridge, their washing machine, their razor, their air con and have a third-degree meltdown when someone mention putting one in a car. I have been an industrial electrician for 50 years this year (with a few gap years driving trucks) electric motors and control systems are my bread and butter and everything we need is there to do the job it only needs one thing and that is a better battery, and it will surprise you how quick it will come.

The idea has more merit now than 100 years ago especially with the massive improvements in magnets from then to now.
Rare earth magnets make the old iron core ones seem obsolete. Not sure what the latest in magnets now but have heard some are almost impossible to pick up off a sheet of steel.

I have a good computer repairer. He saves the rare earth magnets out of computers. They are odd shapes about the size of a thumbnail. If you put them on the fridge you need to prise them off with a knife or screwdriver.

Last couple of restorations I have done I used them to close glovebox lids when the original catches have failed. Need a really big pull to open the lid.

The Magnet Shop  has every type.
magnet.com.au/?tw_source=google&tw_adid=...0P09WH4aAv1MEALw_wcB

The Neodymium magnets (like those out of a computer) are unbelievably strong.

A tiny cylinder magnet 25mm in diameter and 25mm tall will hold nearly 27kg - a lot more than a full jerrycan. A magnet the shape and size of a shirt button can hold half a dozen stubbies!

 

Louie

Man has always upgraded almost everything in our lives as new better inventions came on the market. Bronze axes replaced stone, sails replaced paddles not to mention mail-order brides. We have had free choice and have absolutely no doubt they work better than the item replaced.

The thing that pisses me off is the way a car unquestionably currently far less user-efficient, capable or cheap is being foisted upon us for reasons unrelated to the use to which it is being put. We are constantly being bombarded with hype and what it will do in the future. If it is so bloody good people will be flocking in droves to buy it just like they did with their Model T Fords, electric drills or smart phones. Just let the technology speak for itself. Those on a mission are free to buy it for whatever reason, those who want their lives to be better for the investment will be in the showroom the day it exceeds the capability and cost/benefit of the existing item.

Market forces, supply and demand, free choice is what our society is built on. Subsidising one version of an essential  product and penalising another version to achieve social change is iniquitous.

The electric car is on a trajectory to universal acceptance and you probably will not lose money betting everyone will be driving, and actually WANT one with the improved technology, in 10 years - if hydrogen, magnets or caged squirrels do not overtake them but we live in a free society not Stalin's Moskva or nothing.

It is not the car or the technology that electric resisters (pun) are on about, it is the fact the government (and squeaky wheels) want to take away our favourite tasty cake and force us eat their gluten-free cake which has been taken out of the oven 15 minutes too soon.

Lang I think we can both agree that at the moment we are in the bumpy bit in the middle, for those of us that have space around us, will have free power and will only use the grid to keep it stable, the other half will always rely on grid, the generation systems will change over time, but that other half will see little change other than what drives their energy.

For those of us in our age group, we will probably miss the final outcome, I am not sure people over 70 years of age should be allowed to vote as they are just fiddling with the outcome that they won't live through to suffer the results. Trump getting back in is probably a good thing, when the rest of the world is run by nut jobs we may as well have one to keep things balanced.

If the 7.3 V8 in my F100 blows up which don't expect it to, I would make it Electric, I only do one day a week on site and a day a week in the workshop at home mostly, and a few weeks shut during the year, so it uses bugger all fuel in a year, it will be passed on to the grandson as a diesel I expect, We are looking at replacing our car, we are hanging out to see how the solar system holds up over the next 12 months then decide, I have put a charging post out the front of the workshop anyway as I don't think charging in the carage under the house would be a great idea.

So, what I am saying is stuffed if I know how this is going to turn out, I am just going with my best guess. In my working life I have been Electrician, Truck Driver, Foreman, Site Supervisor, Project Manager and every time I have turned up on site to start a job I have not had a clue what was going on, but you start working on the things you know within a couple of days you are all over it and you are a roll, I think this energy transition is a bit like that, spread out over say 10 years before we get on a roll.

Louie

You are right about the unknowns.

I am sure we are betting the house on a horse that shows good form in regional races but unproven in the big events.

I just hope we are not sitting in the owners enclosure at Flemington when the trainer comes up and says "Our jockey has gone sick but do not worry I have found a replacement"

We look up and there is a bloody Sumo wrestler decked out in our colours being lifted into the saddle.

Lang

Hydrogen

I was just sent this. I will investigate, more to follow.

Australia’s first hydrogen car comes to market, complete with charging stations in just 5 minutes. The car travels 900 kilometers with the tank full and purifies the air as it moves forward.
For the first time, hydrogen fuel cell technology is being applied serialized in a commercial car and, above all, it allows for such important autonomy, with very reduced charging times.
This is Hyundai Nexo, a small-cylinder car that beats all car manufacturers in the world and sets a sustainability record, with a charge of 6.27 kilograms of hydrogen that purifies 449,100 liters of air during the journey (as much as the consumption of breathing of 33 people for a whole day) and it only emits water down your exhaust pipe. This car produces no CO2 or other polluting emissions; just think that an equivalent vehicle, with a traditional combustion engine, emits about 126 kg of CO2 at the same distance.
The hydrogen engine thus enters the automobile market and intends to join the electric one among the sustainable mobility solutions the world is adopting. Hyundai thus becomes the first automaker in the world to produce a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle for the market.

The Toyota Mirai is Toyota's only Hydrogen Electric Vehicle and is currently only available in limited numbers for business fleet to lease. Currently, there is only one Toyota owned hydrogen refueller in Melbourne, Australia.

It would appear both Hyundai and Toyota have had "secret" fleet trials going on in Australia for some time to prove hydrogen technology. The cars are leased to corporate partners and will be handed back at the end of the trials.

I am still looking but they seem to be very successful with refuel times equal to petrol cars and range equal to petrol cars. First reports from limited users indicate an intended very high take up rate if and when they become generally available.

This is an excellent real life road test.

Hyundai have had a Hydrogen refuelling facility in their Macquarie Park Headquarters in Sydney for 5 to 6 years that I'm aware of.

This would suggest they have been running tests for at least that long.

I was under the impression hydrogen (at the moment) is painfully expensive. Obviously the price will drop with scale.

The opposition to hydrogen has been the large amount of electricity to produce making it seem an inefficient exercise.

Looks like there are several different ways to skin a cat and chemical, heat and electrolysis are all in the mix. We have so much gas there seems to be an Australian opportunity.

 As at the end of 2021, almost 47% of the global hydrogen production is from natural gas, 27% from coal, 22% from oil (as a by-product) and only around 4% comes from electrolysis.

 The most important industrial method for the production of hydrogen is the catalytic steam–hydrocarbon process, in which gaseous or vaporized hydrocarbons are treated with steam at high pressure over a nickel catalyst at 650°–950° C to produce carbon oxides and hydrogen: CnH2n+2 + nH2O → nCO + (2n + 1)H2; CnH2n+2 + 2nH ...28 Oct 2024



The cheapest way to produce hydrogen at scale is by steam reforming of hydrocarbons, primarily methane. This process has existed for some time and is widely used to produce hydrogen. No other method can compete economically at this time.17 Feb 2018 

How is hydrogen produced from garbage?
H2-Enterprises' technology relies on a process called “thermolysis” which allows the conversion of plastic and other organic waste to hydrogen and CO2 and it does so without burning a match. The process has two-stages, first, steam reforming, followed by a water gas shift reaction and a gas-separation of H2 and CO2.